If you didn't already know, I copy all of this blog onto My Space, so I can expose myself to the younguns, and more. Such an exhibitionist. Well, my post A Simple Question has received some good attention, and some silly attention. I think you might be interested in seeing what some peeps had to say.
The post is abbreviated, but if you want to see what everyone had to say, check out the blog.
My question is this- Why are atheists ( I'd call you agnostic but whatever, thats a dead horse) so passionite about spreading the word that God doesn't exist? I don't understand the motive. Even just reading that I find the Bible hard to swallow, you get a small feeling of happiness deep down for me, like theres "hope" for me. Why? Is it because of the negitivity christianity has had in the world over the ages? Do you find people who believe in what you don't incredibly annoying? You try and argue compassion for others who are being tricked and decieved, but you have no basis or reason for that compassion and care. To me, you're no different than the christian holding a sign and shouting at women walking into an abortion clinic or telling a gay guy he's going to burn in hell. They have no right or should I say "obligation" to do that, no more than you do to be so passionite about the other side. The idiot christians do this out of lack of understanding of the new covenant, and rush to judgment, ( I'm not saying that they "have it all wrong" and in general christianity is and has been thru the years, a peacefull, caring, loving organization of people) but whats the motive for an atheist? Why are you so pissed off? You argue that we should all love our wives and husbands, kids and family. That we should be nice and care for people....Why? Whats the point? If I didn't believe in something more than humanity, and there was nothing at the end of this race, why run? Who cares? What does it matter? Just becuase humanity has set up these guidlines for good living and whats "right" or "wrong", why should I follow? Why should I submit to humanity if humanity is all there is? If there is no God, then there is no moral compas. If you try to say otherwise, you'd just be attempting to get me to swallow some half assed reasoning that makes you able to sleep at night, much like you would say I do. Morals, "feelings" do not exist in Science. Brain chemistry does, but to not link that with anything other than evolution is just as crazy sounding to me as a vigin birth. Its the old, chicken and the egg bit. You end with the egg, but it makes no sense.
I find atheists just as annoying, frustrating and pissed off as most christian people, especially here in QC, considering the history of "christianity" here. I won't pretend I know everything about God. I won't pretend I don't think alot of the things I read in the Bible aren't weird or horrible, but I believe that God has the final say, not me. I believe His plan is perfect. I think that statement right there is one of the things that get atheists pissed the most, coupled with the fact that you know there isn't a God, even though I claim there is and in fact His plan is better that mine. Yeah, alot of christians are blinded. As the atheist believes that God doesn't exist based on "knowledge" and no "feeling", alot of christians base their faith on a "feeling" and no knowledge. These are the ones that you get to make look stupid, which I'm sure is fun for you and everything, but for me I believe based on alot more than the "feeling". You will reply, "so tell me why you believe". Why do you care? To me, you're just as lost as I am, and need something more as much as I do. You just get to be lost in a funer way than christians, and don't have to exersise faith. Basicly you get to do what you want. If thats working for you, then I'm not going to create a website and a radio program telling people that its not. If it is, it is. Our problem as humans, is that we all want to be "right".
AndrewPosted by Andy on Monday, July 03, 2006 at 12:00 PM
Andy: what did your post have to do with my question? Did you think about it at all, or were you just feeling like you wanted to complain about atheists, and my blog was conventient for you?
Let me try and help you out here a little with your trouble with the concepts of morality and emotion. Somewhere along the way, you have been told that people who like science, and people who find reason important are cold, calculating, and don't care about how people feel. You have been misinformed. Some very creative and passionate people are and were atheists: artists, musicians, philosophers, dancers, and of course scientists. As a matter of fact, I am a musician and an artist myslef, and so is my whole family.
First, I will put to rest your problem with emotion. Emotion is not an imaginary, immaterial thing, and nobody here is trying to pretend it doesn't exist. We need emotions in order to survive and enjoy lid life. So here's a big, bad, old atheist who appreciates, and doesn't poo-poo emotions.
Second, you can't possibly be serious about what you're saying about morality! Andy, do you hear yourself? No point to morality? Seriously, dude, don't be stupid.
Here's the point: give me an earthly, non-religious reason that I shouldn't shoot you. Do you want to be shot? Why shouldn't I kill your family? Think about it for a moment. Can you think of at least one reason for me not to harm you? This is simple, Andy. I am not looking for a deep, philosophical answer. Think of a reason that, well, sounds dumb.
Figured it out?
If you can't, that's what religion does to people. They say stupid stuff like what you said. They (not me, not "atheists,") have had their moral autonomy stripped from them. This is what religion does. I'll try to explain.
What do you see when you look around you, or when you think about the things that matter to you? Do you love anyone? Do you have anything that you love to do, any passion in life? I do. I have many, many things that I love and value. Recruiters want you to forget that any of that exists. Then they "give" yo God. They tell you that God is everything, and all those things that matter are nothing, because they are icky, sinful, low, base, "material things." They tell you that the things that actually EXIST are meaningless, and that imaginary things, the godly, high and powerful "intangible" things "matter." What they're doing is thinking completely backwards.
Now that your thinking is completely opposite from reality, you look at someone like me, an atheist, someone who "doesn't have god." Well, when your thinking is trained up like yours is, naturally, you assume I have NOTHING that MEANS ANYTHING. We are, as many christians like to say, ALONE WITHOUT GOD. Interesting, because that's the exact tactic that abusive lovers use. "You're nothing without me." That's, well, immoral.
Morality, Andy, is very simple. Morality is NOT A LIST OF STUFF OTHER PEOPLE SHOULDN'T DO. Morality is the study of causality in human action. Sounds complicated, but it isn't.
Values are things that you want to attain and keep. Morality is the process of figuring out if those values are reasonable. Causality is the fact that when you do somethng, other stuff happens as a result of it. Do you see now, how religion has nothing to do with morality? Christainity is AMORAL. It says that you must not judge, you must obey. Morality is NOTHING, if not judgement. You have to figure out if your action will cause a good reaction. There is no figuring out in OBEY. Now, look at the ten commandments. Those are not always good values, or reasonable ones. No working on a Sunday? That's silly.
You see, Andy, you are the one who believes that the world is meaningless, not me. I'm sorry you are living this way. I don't. I know, and I am learning how the world is a big place for one person with one life, and there is so much wonder and loveliness and horror and ugliness in it. How sad that you would say its meaningless! And you don't understand why an atheist would ever be angry?
By the way, Andy, I am not afraid of being judged (whoops, Andy, you're judging) "Angry." Anger (an emotion) is not a taboo for me. Anger is an emotion that, when used well, is helpful. But be assured, I am not angry. You may have been told, incorrectly, that anger is something that is always accompanied by violence. Luckily, I am not part of a religion that has one of the many violent gods out there.
And this is why I spread the word. I want more people in my world who are morally autonomous, and have the tools at their disposal to make good decisions about the world, not people who find no value in it.
Posted by Hellbound Alleee on Monday, July 03, 2006 at 6:58 PM